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Old 07-11-2006, 08:14 AM   #1
Jeece
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Default Why can't we all live together in harmony?

Hello there... First post in this forum. I discovered this place about two months ago, I've read some posts and found out some valuable infos during this time... This message is not much a cry for help as it is a rant, but any suggestions/tips would be welcome of course.

I work in a small printshop (4 employees, including the boss) as a graphic designer. Our press is a 2 color Hamada, but with only 1 blanket (offset cylinder?) for both colors. This means the colors must not overlap at all (or not much), else it calls for a big mess. Also, we can't do 4 colors real process. Needless to say, multichannel mode is almost all I use in Photoshop.

Now we have a recurring customer (the City Hall) that now designs it's own booklet (4 issue/year, 4 or 8 pages) in-house. We used to do it, but they thought it'd be cheaper to have a secretary design it, and us just printing it. Hey, I'm not dissing secretaries, but to each his/her job*. She uses Corel on a PC. We run on a Mac, so we can't read pure Corel files.

Last time she included a PDF on the CD along the Corel files, but adios spot colors! (unless there's a way to save them in the file...) I opened the PDF file in Photoshop and multichanneled the heck out of the 8 pages of this CMYK file. Converting CMYK to 4 color spot, I don't wanna do it again.

This time, knowing a new booklet was coming, I tried to find a better solution. I called the City Hall and guided her while she exported the file. I found out Corel could export in EPS. Same thing, spots weren't saved, all I saw when I opened the file was CMYK. I also lose all existing margins when I open it in Photoshop. I must process each page individually, and have to align them all by eye. I went to the City Hall, witnessed the original Corel file's spot colors (it was nicely done, plus it was only 2 colors this time!). Re-saved the files in PDF and EPS, but nothing changed on my side. Still CMYK.

I'm thinking of asking her to send separated files (I dunno if it can be donewith Corel), you know, 1 file per color...

So, what would be your workflow to convert a Corel file with spot colors to something a Mac can print in separation? We have Adobe Suite and Quark 5.

*note* Try explaining a normal person (not working in DTP ) that the color they see on screen isn't the same that come out the press. Also, that choosing only 2 swatches (in CMYK) doesn't count as a 2 color job. I could't get her understand the bleed though... and how to leave a bigger margin on one side for the grippers.

   
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Old 07-11-2006, 08:26 AM   #2
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Default Rants and troubles with clients? We have them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeece
Hello there... First post in this forum. I discovered this place about two months ago, I've read some posts and found out some valuable infos during this time... This message is not much a cry for help as it is a rant, but any suggestions/tips would be welcome of course.

I work in a small printshop (4 employees, including the boss) as a graphic designer. Our press is a 2 color Hamada, but with only 1 blanket (offset cylinder?) for both colors. This means the colors must not overlap at all (or not much), else it calls for a big mess. Also, we can't do 4 colors real process. Needless to say, multichannel mode is almost all I use in Photoshop.

Now we have a recurring customer (the City Hall) that now designs it's own booklet (4 issue/year, 4 or 8 pages) in-house. We used to do it, but they thought it'd be cheaper to have a secretary design it, and us just printing it. Hey, I'm not dissing secretaries, but to each his/her job*. She uses Corel on a PC. We run on a Mac, so we can't read pure Corel files.

Last time she included a PDF on the CD along the Corel files, but adios spot colors! (unless there's a way to save them in the file...) I opened the PDF file in Photoshop and multichanneled the heck out of the 8 pages of this CMYK file. Converting CMYK to 4 color spot, I don't wanna do it again.

This time, knowing a new booklet was coming, I tried to find a better solution. I called the City Hall and guided her while she exported the file. I found out Corel could export in EPS. Same thing, spots weren't saved, all I saw when I opened the file was CMYK. I also lose all existing margins when I open it in Photoshop. I must process each page individually, and have to align them all by eye. I went to the City Hall, witnessed the original Corel file's spot colors (it was nicely done, plus it was only 2 colors this time!). Re-saved the files in PDF and EPS, but nothing changed on my side. Still CMYK.

I'm thinking of asking her to send separated files (I dunno if it can be donewith Corel), you know, 1 file per color...

So, what would be your workflow to convert a Corel file with spot colors to something a Mac can print in separation? We have Adobe Suite and Quark 5.

*note* Try explaining a normal person (not working in DTP ) that the color they see on screen isn't the same that come out the press. Also, that choosing only 2 swatches (in CMYK) doesn't count as a 2 color job. I could't get her understand the bleed though... and how to leave a bigger margin on one side for the grippers.
I am a web developer, not a DTP person, but I read most of the posts here. We all have difficult clients, and some of them are difficult to educate, and your rant could easily be many of us.

Technical help may follow, but I understand and sympathize with your client problems.
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Old 07-11-2006, 08:34 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeece
So, what would be your workflow to convert a Corel file with spot colors to something a Mac can print in separation? We have Adobe Suite and Quark 5.

*note* Try explaining a normal person (not working in DTP ) that the color they see on screen isn't the same that come out the press. Also, that choosing only 2 swatches (in CMYK) doesn't count as a 2 color job. I could't get her understand the bleed though... and how to leave a bigger margin on one side for the grippers.
Hi, Jeece ā€” welcome to the forum. Your English is great. Wish I could write that clearly in any other language!

I do not know for sure what you should do. Iā€™m a designer, too, and I once got a map exported to EPS from Corel and had some color problems, but honestly cannot remember what I did about it.

Others here should be able to help.

And I sure do emphasize with having design work given to an office worker (who probably does not welcome the extra work, either) who has not been taught anything about design or output. It is adding insult to injury that you have to fix the jobs!

(I moved the thread to the Print Production section and retitled it to attract more responses.)

   
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Old 07-11-2006, 08:38 AM   #4
Jeece
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dthomsen8
I am a web developer, not a DTP person, but I read most of the posts here. We all have difficult clients, and some of them are difficult to educate, and your rant could easily be many of us.

Technical help may follow, but I understand and sympathize with your client problems.
Hey, no problem. It's more of a technical issue than a customer one, sorry if the tone of my post showed otherwise. It's not that women's fault, I guess her boss just threw the job in her hands and "cope with it".

   
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Of course I signed the proof, I just didn't proofread it. Don't you do that there?
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Old 07-11-2006, 08:59 AM   #5
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Default Her boss is the one!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeece
Hey, no problem. It's more of a technical issue than a customer one, sorry if the tone of my post showed otherwise. It's not that women's fault, I guess her boss just threw the job in her hands and "cope with it".
Her boss is the one causing your technical problems, not the worker. Doesn't Corel run on the Mac? (That might not help on color problems, though.)
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Old 07-11-2006, 09:19 AM   #6
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Not anymore. I guess I could get an older Mac version for pretty cheap, and get the file saved in an older version though. That'd be worth trying.

Oh, we have VirtualPC installed on our Mac, but it's a *gasp* G4 800mhz with 512mb of Ram. Starting a Windows session strangles so much the poor machine, it's just useless. Anyways I don't think my boss would pay 300$+ for the newest Corel, if we use it 5-6 times a year.

   
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Old 07-11-2006, 09:41 AM   #7
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Your English is perfectly clear, no worries there. Nobody would guess it wasn't your first language if you hadn't mentioned it.

One thing that's not clear though: you mention that the client's creating files in Corel. Corel is a company, they sell lots of different software. Which one is the client using, and what version? Likely candidates are Corel Draw or Corel PhotoPaint but since this isn't a graphics professional, it might be anything.

   
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Old 07-11-2006, 09:59 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Rindsberg
Your English is perfectly clear, no worries there. Nobody would guess it wasn't your first language if you hadn't mentioned it.

One thing that's not clear though: you mention that the client's creating files in Corel. Corel is a company, they sell lots of different software. Which one is the client using, and what version? Likely candidates are Corel Draw or Corel PhotoPaint but since this isn't a graphics professional, it might be anything.
Thanks. My spoken English isn't near as good though, but I've managed to survive a whole weekend in the US during the 4th holidays.

Yup, totally forgot about the Corel thing. They use Corel Draw 12 for the booklet.

I'm currently converting the files to multichannel in Photoshop, it's only a 4 pages (1 two sided, folded 11x17 sheet) and 2 color document... Hey, I'm actually having fun doing it. But it would be easier for me to learn a way before I get another 8 pages, 4 color booklet.

   
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Old 07-11-2006, 10:22 AM   #9
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Hi, Jeece! Welcome!

Let me just say for starters, Corel Draw 12 absolutely can do spot colors, and separated print files. The problem is that the person who really needs to come to the forum and ask these questions is the client. It is very difficult to assist effectively through an intermediate person, however patient and willing! Is there any chance you could send the poor woman here so we can help her directly? For someone experienced with Corel Draw this shouldn't be a difficult task, but for someone new to the program - yikes!

If it is not possible for her to come here, let us know and we'll try to help her through you as best we can. What you are doing - trying to recreate her files in Photoshop - is not only above and beyond the normal call of duty but potentially a disaster waiting to happen ... a lot of things can go wrong in the process, resulting in a frustrated and unhappy client. As a person who has been on the other side - client sending press-ready PDF files to the printer - the last thing I would want the printer to do is mess with my file in Photoshop. But I realize you have a client who just doesn't know enough yet about the program she's using to create files you can use so up to now you haven't had much choice! Bless you for doing so much to help her!

   
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Old 07-11-2006, 10:38 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeece
Not anymore. I guess I could get an older Mac version for pretty cheap, and get the file saved in an older version though. That'd be worth trying.

Oh, we have VirtualPC installed on our Mac, but it's a *gasp* G4 800mhz with 512mb of Ram. Starting a Windows session strangles so much the poor machine, it's just useless. Anyways I don't think my boss would pay 300$+ for the newest Corel, if we use it 5-6 times a year.
I would probably ditch both of these ideas ... the Mac version would be quite elderly by now and I'm not sure it was all that good to begin with. And it sounds as though your VirtualPC machine has its hands full just running Windows!

   
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