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Michael Rowley · 02-13-2005, 02:13 PM

I am having trouble keeping fonts out of Windows\Fonts: no matter that all my fonts are correctly installed in Windows\Fonts\ATMfolder or the PSFonts folder and removed from Windows\Fonts (apart from rather a lot have to be there), they keep coming back. What am I doing wrong?

Perhaps I'm expecting too much of ATM de Luxe, which is getting a bit long in the tooth; perhaps it's powerless against Windows XP.

terrie · 02-14-2005, 10:32 AM

I'm not sure I can help both because I'm running W2K but also because I use ATMLight rather than ATM Deluxe...however...

I use FontNavigator and what it does is to put shortcuts in the Winnt\Fonts folder for any "active" fonts...are you *sure* that your not seeing a shortcut for the fonts you see in the \Fonts folder?

Terrie

Franca · 02-14-2005, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Rowley

I am having trouble keeping fonts out of Windows\Fonts: no matter that all my fonts are correctly installed in Windows\Fonts\ATMfolder or the PSFonts folder and removed from Windows\Fonts (apart from rather a lot have to be there), they keep coming back. What am I doing wrong?

Perhaps I'm expecting too much of ATM de Luxe, which is getting a bit long in the tooth; perhaps it's powerless against Windows XP.

I dimly recall other folks having problems with the ATM Deluxe/Win XP combination. I think the recommendation was to do what Terrie is doing - use ATM Light with Bitstream Font Navigator, or dispense with ATM altogether. Supposedly XP does not need it, but I have also heard people say that things worked better with ATM Light. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a true consensus - I also know people using ATM Deluxe successfully with XP!

I currently am using Font Navigator with no ATM installed on my XP Pro system. Even though I always do Custom installs and deselect any fonts if I'm asked, stuff still gets dropped into Windows\Fonts without my permission, so I check it periodically and clean it out. I drag fonts to my Fonts folder and shortcuts are left behind in Windows\Fonts. But it can be fussy! I quit using ATM Deluxe years ago because it was making a mess of things on my system, but your mileage may vary as they say.... Sorry I can't be of more help! I'll see if I can find someone with more current wisdom on this subject.

Michael Rowley · 02-14-2005, 12:01 PM

Franca & Terrie:

I am sure that I have many fonts in WinNT\Fonts (I said Windows\Fonts, but the Windows NT users know what I mean) that I know I have made sure that (a) I've copied them to WinNT\Fonts\ATM and (b) that I've removed them afterwards—several times!—from WinNT\Fonts; the only short cuts to fonts in WinNT\Fonts are the to the fonts I have currently got activated in ATM, which include both TT and T1 fonts. The 'escapees' are also shown as active in ATM, but that is because they are in WinNT\Fonts (and are automatically active).

Not all my fonts are in WinNT\Fonts: only the ones that Windows XP doesn't allow me to delete (including the ones that can apparently be deleted but reappear after a pause) and the escapees. The latter appear to be many of the fonts supplied with Windows XP & Office, but not all of them, I think; and most of my 1500 or so fonts are happily in their rightful places. But having so many fonts active is said to slow down some programs.

I have never tried Font Navigator, but perhaps I should, and ditch ATM de Luxe, which Adobe doesn't seem to care about any more. ATM Light wouldn't appear necessary, as Windows NT5 (or later) can deal perfectly well with Type 1 fonts.

terrie · 02-14-2005, 12:33 PM

>>Michael: (a) I've copied them to WinNT\Fonts\ATM

Hmmm...wonder if this is the "problem" right here...I have all my fonts stored on a separate drive (H:\Fonts) with a subdir "PSFonts" which is where I directed ATMLight to install the fonts...

Would it be a real pita and a half to move stuff from winnt\fonts\atm to someplace outside the winnt directory? Not sure if it would help but...

Terrie

Michael Rowley · 02-14-2005, 01:35 PM

Terrie:

'move stuff from winnt\fonts\atm to someplace outside the winnt directory'

That might help, but the WinNT\Fonts\ATM folder is the one created by ATM de Luxe and specified by Adobe as the one to use for TT fonts. I think just opening the WinNT\Fonts folder may trigger off the reinstallation of the core Microsoft fonts, but to look at the WinNT\Fonts\ATM folder it is necessary to open WinNT\Fonts first! As a rule, there would be no need to open the \ATM folder, but if you want to look at the extended properties of a TT font file (usually to find the 'permissions'), that's the only way, as properties shown inside ATM de Luxe are pretty skimpy.

Windows NT5 has the equivalent of ATM Light already (the ATM driver), but the font manager is in ATM de Luxe.

Font Navigator seems to have been discontinued, though Bitware stil gives technical support for it. Its replacement seems to be FontReserve (from another supplier), which costs $100. I'm taking a look at it—30 days free trial—but I'm loath to part with more money for a font manager when I've already bought ATM de Luxe, for which its makers (Adobe) also claim is the solution to font problems.

terrie · 02-14-2005, 02:10 PM

>>michael: That might help, but the WinNT\Fonts\ATM folder is the one created by ATM de Luxe and specified by Adobe as the one to use for TT fonts.

Hmmm...ATMLight let's me specify a user defined folder...I'd be surprised if ATM Deluxe didn't let you do that too...ATMLight has virtually no documentation but I would suspect that ATM Deluxe would have more info...might be worth checking it out?

>> I think just opening the WinNT\Fonts folder may trigger off the reinstallation of the core Microsoft fonts,

It doesn't in W2K...

>>Windows NT5 has the equivalent of ATM Light already (the ATM driver), but the font manager is in ATM de Luxe.

Right...with W2K, if I didn't have MM fonts, I wouldn't need ATM at all...

>>Font Navigator seems to have been discontinued, though Bitware stil gives technical support for it.

Oh...that's right...Font Navigator comes with CorelDraw/Paint...I think Corel must have bought it from BitStream...you don't happen to have that lying around someplace do you??? I'm still using FN3 which I bought from BitStream...not sure if it would run in XP...

Terrie

JVegVT · 02-18-2005, 03:43 PM

>> I'm still using FN3 which I bought from BitStream...not sure if it would run in XP... >>

It does. Remember there is very little difference between W2K and XP as far as operation goes. W2K is NT 5; XP is NT 5.1.
--Judy M.

terrie · 02-19-2005, 01:19 PM

>>jvegvt: It does.

I figured it did...

Terrie

marlene · 02-16-2005, 03:38 PM

I know you are reluctant -- understandably -- to shell out more money for a font manager, but thought I would post this anyway just as general information if anyone is in the market for FontNav.

The way I got my current version of FontNav was to buy a cheap, older version of CorelDraw. FontNav was part of the bundle. I bought a shrink-wrapped, legit (I was able to register it) CorelDraw retail version 9 package on eBay for $55, and that was in 2001. It's possible that earlier versions (which would be even cheaper now) also included the newest version of FontNav.

It's also a good way to get a bunch of Bitstream fonts. Although I think I remember someone saying that the more recent versions of CorelDraw no longer include the PostScript versions. (But I could be totally disremembering that.)

However, since FontNav doesn't handle OT, I'm eager to hear what everyone says about FontReserve.

mxh

02-13-2005, 02:13 PM	#1
Michael Rowley Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Ipswich (the one in England) Posts: 5,105	Windows\Fonts I am having trouble keeping fonts out of Windows\Fonts: no matter that all my fonts are correctly installed in Windows\Fonts\ATMfolder or the PSFonts folder and removed from Windows\Fonts (apart from rather a lot have to be there), they keep coming back. What am I doing wrong? Perhaps I'm expecting too much of ATM de Luxe, which is getting a bit long in the tooth; perhaps it's powerless against Windows XP. __________________ Michael

02-14-2005, 12:01 PM	#4
Michael Rowley Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Ipswich (the one in England) Posts: 5,105	Franca & Terrie: I am sure that I have many fonts in WinNT\Fonts (I said Windows\Fonts, but the Windows NT users know what I mean) that I know I have made sure that (a) I've copied them to WinNT\Fonts\ATM and (b) that I've removed them afterwards—several times!—from WinNT\Fonts; the only short cuts to fonts in WinNT\Fonts are the to the fonts I have currently got activated in ATM, which include both TT and T1 fonts. The 'escapees' are also shown as active in ATM, but that is because they are in WinNT\Fonts (and are automatically active). Not all my fonts are in WinNT\Fonts: only the ones that Windows XP doesn't allow me to delete (including the ones that can apparently be deleted but reappear after a pause) and the escapees. The latter appear to be many of the fonts supplied with Windows XP & Office, but not all of them, I think; and most of my 1500 or so fonts are happily in their rightful places. But having so many fonts active is said to slow down some programs. I have never tried Font Navigator, but perhaps I should, and ditch ATM de Luxe, which Adobe doesn't seem to care about any more. ATM Light wouldn't appear necessary, as Windows NT5 (or later) can deal perfectly well with Type 1 fonts. __________________ Michael

02-14-2005, 01:35 PM	#6
Michael Rowley Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Ipswich (the one in England) Posts: 5,105	Terrie: 'move stuff from winnt\fonts\atm to someplace outside the winnt directory' That might help, but the WinNT\Fonts\ATM folder is the one created by ATM de Luxe and specified by Adobe as the one to use for TT fonts. I think just opening the WinNT\Fonts folder may trigger off the reinstallation of the core Microsoft fonts, but to look at the WinNT\Fonts\ATM folder it is necessary to open WinNT\Fonts first! As a rule, there would be no need to open the \ATM folder, but if you want to look at the extended properties of a TT font file (usually to find the 'permissions'), that's the only way, as properties shown inside ATM de Luxe are pretty skimpy. Windows NT5 has the equivalent of ATM Light already (the ATM driver), but the font manager is in ATM de Luxe. Font Navigator seems to have been discontinued, though Bitware stil gives technical support for it. Its replacement seems to be FontReserve (from another supplier), which costs $100. I'm taking a look at it—30 days free trial—but I'm loath to part with more money for a font manager when I've already bought ATM de Luxe, for which its makers (Adobe) also claim is the solution to font problems. __________________ Michael

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02-14-2005, 10:32 AM	#2
terrie Staff Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 10,083	I'm not sure I can help both because I'm running W2K but also because I use ATMLight rather than ATM Deluxe...however... I use FontNavigator and what it does is to put shortcuts in the Winnt\Fonts folder for any "active" fonts...are you sure that your not seeing a shortcut for the fonts you see in the \Fonts folder? Terrie

02-14-2005, 12:33 PM	#5
terrie Staff Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 10,083	>>Michael: (a) I've copied them to WinNT\Fonts\ATM Hmmm...wonder if this is the "problem" right here...I have all my fonts stored on a separate drive (H:\Fonts) with a subdir "PSFonts" which is where I directed ATMLight to install the fonts... Would it be a real pita and a half to move stuff from winnt\fonts\atm to someplace outside the winnt directory? Not sure if it would help but... Terrie

02-14-2005, 02:10 PM	#7
terrie Staff Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 10,083	>>michael: That might help, but the WinNT\Fonts\ATM folder is the one created by ATM de Luxe and specified by Adobe as the one to use for TT fonts. Hmmm...ATMLight let's me specify a user defined folder...I'd be surprised if ATM Deluxe didn't let you do that too...ATMLight has virtually no documentation but I would suspect that ATM Deluxe would have more info...might be worth checking it out? >> I think just opening the WinNT\Fonts folder may trigger off the reinstallation of the core Microsoft fonts, It doesn't in W2K... >>Windows NT5 has the equivalent of ATM Light already (the ATM driver), but the font manager is in ATM de Luxe. Right...with W2K, if I didn't have MM fonts, I wouldn't need ATM at all... >>Font Navigator seems to have been discontinued, though Bitware stil gives technical support for it. Oh...that's right...Font Navigator comes with CorelDraw/Paint...I think Corel must have bought it from BitStream...you don't happen to have that lying around someplace do you??? I'm still using FN3 which I bought from BitStream...not sure if it would run in XP... Terrie

02-18-2005, 03:43 PM	#8
JVegVT Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: northern New England, USA Posts: 510	>> I'm still using FN3 which I bought from BitStream...not sure if it would run in XP... >> It does. Remember there is very little difference between W2K and XP as far as operation goes. W2K is NT 5; XP is NT 5.1. --Judy M.

02-19-2005, 01:19 PM	#9
terrie Staff Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 10,083	>>jvegvt: It does. I figured it did... Terrie

02-16-2005, 03:38 PM	#10
marlene Staff Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,419	I know you are reluctant -- understandably -- to shell out more money for a font manager, but thought I would post this anyway just as general information if anyone is in the market for FontNav. The way I got my current version of FontNav was to buy a cheap, older version of CorelDraw. FontNav was part of the bundle. I bought a shrink-wrapped, legit (I was able to register it) CorelDraw retail version 9 package on eBay for $55, and that was in 2001. It's possible that earlier versions (which would be even cheaper now) also included the newest version of FontNav. It's also a good way to get a bunch of Bitstream fonts. Although I think I remember someone saying that the more recent versions of CorelDraw no longer include the PostScript versions. (But I could be totally disremembering that.) However, since FontNav doesn't handle OT, I'm eager to hear what everyone says about FontReserve. mxh