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ktinkel
03-26-2007, 02:12 PM
Probably the last person on the planet to do so, too!

I was googling for the source of a CD to send to an ailing friend, accidentally clicked on a radio link, and up popped iTunes. Very exciting.

I copied a CD to it, and it really isn’t bad, even with only the built-in Mac speakers. Maybe I will go looking for music on the web — live large! <g>

iamback
03-26-2007, 02:34 PM
Maybe I will go looking for music on the web — live large! <g>I'd advise you to do that - but leave iTunes alone.

It ties you into its own format, is extremely dumb when it comes to organizing a music collection (it wants to copy everything to its own space - rather than organizing what you already have where you have it, and forget about networked drives), and what you get from their site you don't usage rights to like you get from buying a CD or even most download sites.

Run away, fast! I mean that.

ktinkel
03-26-2007, 05:08 PM
Run away, fast! I mean that.So what do you recommend?

Shane Stanley
03-26-2007, 09:49 PM
I'd advise you to do that - but leave iTunes alone.

It ties you into its own format

You're confusing iTunes with the iTunes store. iTunes doesn't tie you to any format.

is extremely dumb when it comes to organizing a music collection (it wants to copy everything to its own space

That's an option you can turn on or off in Preferences (actually, it's two preferences).

and what you get from their site you don't usage rights to like you get from buying a CD or even most download sites.

Actually, you may even get greater *legal* rights. And you can burn it all to a normal CD.

Run away, fast! I mean that.

It appears your advice is based on some serious misunderstandings.

Shane

ktinkel
03-27-2007, 05:43 AM
You're confusing iTunes with the iTunes store. iTunes doesn't tie you to any format.

Actually, you may even get greater *legal* rights. And you can burn it all to a normal CD.Whew! It is about as ambitious as I think I will ever be about music on the computer, so glad to hear that I can safely play with it.

dogmandouglas
03-27-2007, 08:00 AM
Hi Kathleen

I use iTunes but not the iTunes store. The program is great for ripping store bought CDs and converting them into mp3s for use on my player.

Also it accesses the database online and put the names on the tracks for me.

As for iTunes organising my songs – saves me doing it!

Cheers

Doug

ktinkel
03-27-2007, 08:26 AM
I use iTunes but not the iTunes store. The program is great for ripping store bought CDs and converting them into mp3s for use on my player.

Also it accesses the database online and put the names on the tracks for me.

As for iTunes organising my songs – saves me doing it!That is how it seemed to me, too, though I have not poked around too much.

I copied a CD and it did place the track titles but not much else. Had to use Get Info to add the genre, and then had to make one up, as none of the presets had anything to do with what I had. Then I tried to get it to retrieve the album cover, but got a message that I would have to sign up for that.

Meanwhile, I have an old iTunes; have never updated it when I update the OS. No telling what I may discover if I bring it up to date!

It is fun. I have a stereo system right here (with better speakers), so it isn’t clear how much I am likely to listen to it. On the other hand, if I can figure out how to purchase online and can find some of the old out-of-print music that interests me, that would be useful.

iamback
03-27-2007, 08:37 AM
You're confusing iTunes with the iTunes store. iTunes doesn't tie you to any format.But iTunes does its utmost to get you to the store - annoyingly so.

That's an option you can turn on or off in Preferences (actually, it's two preferences).Maybe on a Mac? I just could not even navigate to a network drive - it wants everything local. I want everything on a network drive.

Actually, you may even get greater *legal* rights. And you can burn it all to a normal CD.May, indeed. But that seems to be an exception. In fact, you also may find that for the music you downloaded you suddenly have fewer rights than you had when you downloaded (and paid for) it.

It appears your advice is based on some serious misunderstandings.Well, I don't think so. The stories about the rights you may, or may not, have, and may not even keep, can be found all over. It's not required to go to the store but it tries its utmost to get you there. And there's no support for even accessing (let alone organizing) music on a network drive - at least not in the Windows version. I tried that, could not, uninstalled. I've tried a ton of music organizers - iTunes was easily the stupidest of them all.

iamback
03-27-2007, 08:54 AM
So what do you recommend?Going by my experience with Windows programs (I can't test anything Mac), almost anything that plays and/or organizes music will be more capable than iTunes. A friend pointed me to it, saying it had support for Unicode; so I tried it. No support for Unicode: I could not enter song titles that had Unicode characters in them; it won't organize CDs - it wants to copy them; it won't access network drives. As you found, you need an iTunes account just to access cover images (other programs don't require this, and there are other sites that have cover art than just the iTunes store). The data it can store is far too limited for any serious music collector - and since it can't store data about CDs, there's also no concept of a "place code" to find where that CD actually is - all it knows about are the files on a local HD.

There are countless free programs than can rip CDs (if that's what you want to do), even more that can play CDs and MP3s, or radio stations. So many for the PC, I can't imagine there aren't at least several for the Mac as well.

So spend some time looking around and testing - that's better than spending time setting up your data in the first program you stumbled over only to find later the program is far too limited and you have to do it all over again anyway.

But if all you want is play... OK - then use iTunes, cause in my opinion it's nothing more than a toy. I spent considerable time testing a lot of programs - and in fact nothing right now even matches my requirements! - but iTunes was the worst, least capable and most annoying of them all. But I saw it after having tested several professional-level programs already - if it's the first thing you see, it may seem attractive. For a while. Until you see a serious program...

Mike
03-27-2007, 09:35 AM
Probably the last person on the planet to do so, too!

I've recently discovered the iTunes podcasts section. There's a wealth of lectures from Universities among other things -- a superb resource. It's easy to subscribe to podcast series that download in the background when iTunes is open so you can listen to them any time you want.

Tate Events, The British Museum, The University of Edinburgh and the University of Bath are my current favourites.

Steve Rindsberg
03-27-2007, 11:13 AM
>> But iTunes does its utmost to get you to the store - annoyingly so.

That may depend on what you do with it. I haven't noticed it veering in the direction of the iTunes store ever, but I only use it for ripping CDs, playing them back and transferring them to the iPod.

I just looked at preferences on the Mac version and it appears that it'll allow me to store music on network drives (shared from a Windows server, in fact).

Perhaps the Windows version is quite different from the Mac version?

PeterArnel
03-27-2007, 11:42 AM
"I hums" is even better :-)
Those Terry Pratchet readers will understand - the imp who lives in the personal disorganiser has the ability to remember 1500 tunes and can hum them back to u (I Hums)
Peter

iamback
03-27-2007, 11:58 AM
"I hums" is even better :-)
Those Terry Pratchet readers will understand - the imp who lives in the personal disorganiser has the ability to remember 1500 tunes and can hum them back to u (I Hums)hum... I think I am my own "personal disorganiser" :p - and I need some serious music software to catalog and organize my music collection (for which, BTW, downloading titles from online databases only rarely works - let alone cover and other art - I've added more to those than I've retrieved from them so far...)

iamback
03-27-2007, 12:05 PM
>> But iTunes does its utmost to get you to the store - annoyingly so.

That may depend on what you do with it. I haven't noticed it veering in the direction of the iTunes store ever, but I only use it for ripping CDs, playing them back and transferring them to the iPod.Well, there's the fact that you need an iTunes account to even access cover art - it's totally tied in with one online database only. Plenty of good, free ripping software around (and I rarely rip anyway, usually I just play my CDs; the only occasion I rip is when I go on a big trip and want to take some music of my destination countrie(s) with me - not this year since I haven't found any music from Yemen yet). iPod? not for me - it may be fashionable but I go for functionality, and on that it loses from most of its competitors.

Perhaps the Windows version is quite different from the Mac version?Possibly - but somehow I doubt the differences are very great. But not owning a Mac I can't really tell - it's just a gut feeling (the Windows version feels more like a Mac program than a Windows program to me).

Perhaps there aren't any really good music programs for the Mac? ;)

Cristen Gillespie
03-28-2007, 07:02 AM
Marjolein: As you found, you need an iTunes account just to access cover images (other programs don't require this, and there are other sites that have cover art than just the iTunes store).

Actually, KT is on a Mac, and she doesn't need an iTunes account to access cover art. There's a widget that gets it from Amazon. One of the top 100 widgets, has been for a long time. I've never been to the iTunes store, but if I had broadband, I'd probably download some podcasts.

My needs aren't yours, obviously. I haven't been sorry to have the free iTunes for storing my music. I get the titles of tracks automatically so long as I'm online, can make and delete playlists easily enough, burn CDs easily enough, and can find a song or album pretty quickly, and that's all I'm looking for. If iTunes is really the worst out there, it's doing pretty well for the person not looking for a major, comprehensive system for organizing their vast music collection.

Cyranetta
03-28-2007, 11:03 AM
Jack has our old LPs in the basement; maybe I can persuade him to look for the folk music from way back when. It would be interesting to hear it again, and I am sure we can find a way to digitize it. (But no promises. At least I can find out if we still have those albums.)

One "toy" after which I currently lust is the Ion USB turntable, which seems to make the process of transferring LP's to digital format much easier

-rje-

Steve Rindsberg
03-28-2007, 01:40 PM
>>Well, there's the fact that you need an iTunes account to even access cover art - it's totally tied in with one online database only.

Hmm. I don't know if that's true of the Mac version or not. I do have an iTunes acct (wanted to try it out, haven't seen the need to go back). But I don't especially need cover art. So ... [shrug]

>Plenty of good, free ripping software around (and I rarely rip anyway, usually I just play my CDs;

They won't fit in my iPod. ;-)

>>iPod? not for me - it may be fashionable but I go for functionality, and on that it loses from most of its competitors.

I had the Mac doing little but sitting there; figured I may as well turn it into a jukebox and get some add'l use out of it. The iPod works well with iTunes. Fashionable or not, it works well for me, does all I need it to and quite well.

I'd guess that there are plenty of other programs for the Mac (it *is* Unix underneath the pretty face, after all). I just haven't felt the need to look.

ElyseC
03-28-2007, 07:13 PM
live large! <g>Go for it! :D

I enjoy iTunes a lot, feeding it my own CDs, and have made only one purchase -- a cast recording of a musical my son wanted to try out for (local community theater production), so he could learn the music for the tryout. (At age 6 you learn lines and songs best by hearing than testing your very minimal reading ability. :))

I needed the recording in a big fat hurry and didn't have time to drive around to music stores in hopes they'd have the right one, plus it would have cost a lot more buying a physical CD. It's not one I otherwise had interest in having in my collection, so $10 for the entire thing in electronic version made far better sense than $17 plus gas to drive hither and yon (and maybe not find at all). Plus, as I say, I didn't have time to drive about, certainly no time to order from Amazon. I was very pleased.

Will I buy from iTunes store again? Perhaps, but it'll probably only happen for special circumstances. For recordings I seriously want in my music collection, I like having the physical disk and its "liner" notes.

iTunes is also fabulous for importing my chorus' learning tracks and burning myself custom CDs for part learning and practice while driving in the car.

Cristen Gillespie
03-29-2007, 09:07 AM
One "toy" after which I currently lust is the Ion USB turntable, which seems to make the process of transferring LP's to digital format much easier

-rje-

Thanks. I either have to buy another component and find room to string a bunch together to record albums to CD, or maybe get this one. I'd never heard of it before but I'm looking into it now. It's not cheap, but it's not terribly expensive either. I could re-gift it to my BIL and make him finish digitizing his collection to something at least usable<G>

bmann
04-04-2007, 09:33 AM
I, too, have been a long time iTunes user. I've used a few other mp3 playing softwares. I was a Winamp user a looong time ago. I do like the interface of iTunes, although being a lifelong Windows user, it was initially unfamiliar and frustrating. Within the last year I've become a frequent Mac user and even acquired an iPod. One feature that is really handy is that I can access anyone's music on our network and they can access mine when using iTunes. When I plug in my iPod, they can access that too, thanks to a Mac program called Music Publisher (http://projects.tynsoe.org/en/musicpublisher/).

A few notes - I have never bought music from the iTunes Store and don't really intend to. I'm not comfortable with the restrictions they put on the files, although that can be circumvented if you want it bad enough. Album art, I've always just googled for it or looked it up on Amazon.